RideForum.NET

I recently joined the Arkansas Off Highway Vehicle Conservation Association (AOCA). I'm trying to figure out where and how I can help preserve our right to enjoy the public forests and how to educate my fellow OHV enthusiasts to ride responsibly. Below are links to some of the things I've been reading lately. Some interesting quotes, etc.

The viewpoint of a retired US Forest Service District Ranger
http://arkansasohv.org/AOCA/phpBB3/view ... nread#p346

The other side
http://www.wildlandscpr.org/about-us

I don't really want to start an arguement over the issue of OHV use on public lands, but I think a clear distinction needs to be made. In my last trip to Arkansas (limited as it was) there was a clear difference in the effect the 4-wheelers have had in the last few years on some trails. In my opinion, if trail use was limited to licensed vehicles on two wheels (making exceptions for handicapped individuals) that would be fine by me. Don't get me wrong. There is a place for 4-wheeled ATV's, but their effect on trails is clearly more damaging than motorcycles. Unfortunately, both groups have the goal of keeping public land accessible. We are paying taxes to support such places and should be able to enjoy them from the saddle of our choice. However, I liken the relationship between 4-wheel OHV's and motorcycles as that between the NRA and gun-owners at large. The NRA would like to see hardly any limits on gun ownership where gun-owners at large don't disagree with some limits (fully automatic weapons, bazooka's, etc.).

The ultimate answer is probably for all parties that use and enjoy the trails to work together and ensure that we and our friends act responsibly when we are out on the trail. Otherwise we'll have to trade in our bikes for horses or hiking boots and say goodbye to to some truly awesome rides.

"Keep the ATV's out of the creeks, don't ride in the mud or leave tire tracks on the rocks." If this abuse continues you will lose the right to ride ATVs on public property. Thread softly and leave the rough stuff on private land.

That quote made me smirk, I mean really, the horror of riding in mud or leaving tire tracks on rocks? This person doesn't hide where he stands and that's "no off road vehicles in the public forest." I don't think you can change some peoples minds no matter what. In the grand big picture of things we are only using a small sliver of a trail through a very large forest. Even if a 4wheeler finds a mud hole and carves it out deeper by spinning thier tires they are only ruining the trail, not the forest. We aren't logging and if you've ever seen an area that's been logged that's real damage and even that will grow back again. I'll do my part by not littering and staying on trails but some of these people would want you to carry your own poop out of the forest because human turds are not part of the forest. If you think I'm kidding I'm not. There is a 4 person endurance race called eco-challenge that the racers cannot even leave a turd in the forest. They make them carry them out.

slimtrader wrote:some of these people would want you to carry your own poop out of the forest because human turds are not part of the forest. If you think I'm kidding I'm not. There is a 4 person endurance race called eco-challenge that the racers cannot even leave a turd in the forest. They make them carry them out.

In desert environments the least you should do is pack out your toilet paper. In the Grand Canyon, boaters are required to pack out everything. Hikers are required to pack out TP. (No fires are allowed in the backcountry.). In a dry environment that terd is going to take a long time to degrade. BTW, the bacteria in your terd (most of it is bacteria) is not native to that environment. Therein lies the problem.

Having canoed many times in the Boundary Waters, Quetico, White Otter (Ontario), and north east of Winnipeg out in the bush (flew in on a float plane), I have seen the degredation of the wilderness experience b/c of people not crapping off of the trail and not burying TP. The terd is gone on a few weeks. The TP sticks around for at least a year. Not what I want to see, or step on for that matter.

I am a canoer, whitewater kayaker, backpacker, mountain biker, and OHV rider (motorcycle, licensed, on the trail). If we want to keep areas open we are going to have to do a better job of self-policing in terms of loud exhaust, off trail wandering, eroded stream crossings (sediment in the streams), etc.

Reasons why:
- Exhaust: When I am in the backcountry / wilderness much of the enjoyment comes from not seeing or hearing anything outside of the natural setting. If someboyd is on a motorcycle with a 110 dB pipe two miles away, that might be anoying. Remember that for every 10 dB the sound intensity doubles, thus a 110 dB sound is 4x's the intensity of a 90 dB sound. Further, if you double the distance from the source, the ear hears one-fourth the source intensity. Thus, for me to have a wilderness experience with some yahoo on his loud bike over yonder, he or I needs to be twice as far away. That is going to result in an increase in the no-motorized-zone. BTW, my opposition also applies to airplanes overflying below a certain threshold altitude, etc.

- Stream sedimentation: Trails that are built well do not appreciably erode. Unfortunately many of the trails we ride were done with a bulldozer following a straight line. When it rains, water runs straight down the trail, picking up sediment, and clouds up the stream it feeds into. This affects aquatic life for miles downstream. Not a problem with one trail, but a bigger problem with multiple streams. This also occurs at poorly placed stream crossings. And if you dump your bike in the stream, the gasoline and oil in the stream cause even more damage. A few drops of oil on the surface of the water will spread over a large area. This smothes insect eggs/larvae. Why care? Because this is an important part of the food chain for the fish. As to the gasoline I hope you are getting your drinking water out of that stream. A lot of energy is required to adequately remove the contaminants. This same reason is why wandering off trail, making new trails, etc. is bad. One case where a new trail would be warranted would be to replace an outdated (highly eroded) trail with a new one that drains without the problems above. An example of this is the mountain bike trails at Shanwee Mision Park. The old trails cut straight up and down hillsides, etc. Over the yeeas they got to be highly eroded. The EarthRiders group rerouted the trails and blocked off the old ones. The new ones don't erode. There are gates up that tell if the trail is closed when muddy. If you bike on it when muddy you do a lot of damage. (BTW, I am not saying stay out of the forest when it is muddy. But popular trails are probably not the place to be if you are going to do a lot of damage by riding them when muddy. Ride the areas that are rocky and that dry out faster.)

Time enough on my soap box ...

I guess I could step in here also. I worked in MO for 3 years with the OCDA. Ozark Cave Diving Alliance. We worked in conjunction with Wild Life and Parks and the National Forest service Mapping under water caves for the state. Water testing was one of out biggest steps in the exploration and mapping of the caves or springs. Along with lots of other things like rock samples, soil, mud samples, fish counts, etc etc. But the water testing was very important to the state. They looked for pollutants from nearby construction sites, building, or agriculture. Preserving the water, plant, and fish life in these caves were very important. They have found plant life in caves and surounding area in MO that is not found anywhere else in the world. THIS is HUGH if you can imagine. So lots of steps are being taken to preserve these areas. Part of our water testing was to do Dye Testing. They would dump Biodegradable dye in a river or spring and see where it shows up in a week or so down stream. Dye testings have shown up some 40 miles from sorce or dumping point. A good case of this is Alley Spring outside of Eminence Mo. They have a sign by the spring showing where dye testing took place and points of enterence etc. We worked on Alley spring for 2 years and ended our Exploration at just about a mile into the cave system with depths reaching 150' underwater.

So If you think dumping your bike in the river and spilling Gas, Oil isnt an big deal......think again. It sure can be. Now just once may not be that big a deal but if the stream or area gets lots of use, it starts compounding.

Mo was not the only state we worked in. We also did diving in AR and Oklahoma. It was very interesting working with them.


Hayden

I'm a huge opponent of littering, and often pick up other people's trash, but I'm gonna have to draw the line at carrying my poop out. Sorry, nature, but you are gonna have to deal with my foreign bacteria. I'll dig a small hole and bury it, but I ain't carrying it out. I guess I'll never get to do the Eco-Challenge.

Nature owes me a few anyway. I seem to recall more than one nasty episode with poison ivy.

Yea nature owes me one also from last years canoe trip. It wasnt pretty.


Hayden

Maybe I'm a little slow but I don't understand what my poo bacteria is going to do to the big forest? I don't want to see it either and don't want places like the boundry waters canoe area looking like woodstock just ended. I just think nature is more resilient than what we give it credit for and unless hundreds of us crap in the same spot it's only an eyesore, not a natural tradgedy. I'm not trying to start anything with you Mike (safri) I admire your knowledge on a broad range of subjects. I just get a little heated when responsible use of our resources is attacked (by other than you) or when any action by human activity is considered bad as if we are not part of nature. Example: a beaver can chew down trees and build dams, or a forest fire sparked by lightening are both considered natural but my deficating is somehow bad and doesn't belong. I think I am for the most part responsible and that others out there in the atv and motorcycle community are making it difficult for us. Trying to do better and educating others will help and should be done but there will always be a group out there that opposes our sport.

By the way Mike, I'll try not to leave you lost at an intersection this year if you promise not to use your teacher voice on me.

slimtrader wrote:...when any action by human activity is considered bad as if we are not part of nature. Example: a beaver can chew down trees and build dams, or a forest fire sparked by lightening are both considered natural but my deficating is somehow bad and doesn't belong.

Excellent point. Humans "belong" in the forest, too. Our beer cans and plastic bags do not, but it is OK for humans to be in the forest.

On another note, I noticed a new truck commercial last night--don't remember if it was Ford or Chevy, but it was one of those two. It showed a manly truck carrying manly toys with manly men--in the forest. It shows the manly man jumping on his ATV with a big grin...and roosting away from the truck spinning his tires and flinging rocks and dirt in a huge spray behind him. Nice. This helps our image...not.

See, that's why we should all be riding these.

http://zeromotorcycles.com/

Troy's got some jack saved up after selling his bling-bling DR I'm sure, why don't you go first.

Ian

iyeager wrote:Troy's got some jack saved up after selling his bling-bling DR I'm sure, why don't you go first.

Dude, after selling that DR, I'm so money I don't even know it.

slimtrader wrote:Maybe I'm a little slow but I don't understand what my poo bacteria is going to do to the big forest?

By the way Mike, I'll try not to leave you lost at an intersection this year if you promise not to use your teacher voice on me.

One poo isn't the issue. The problem comes with use by many.

The forest isn't an issue, as the environment is relatively humid and the poo will be gone shortly, as will the TP. Of course pooping off the trail is considerate of others. Bury the TP with the poo in a "cathole." In a desert environment, the TP won't biodegrade for years due to the lack of moisture. Burn it, carefully, if allowed. In the GCNP no fires are allowed. If the desert area gets high use, then packing out becomes the only alternative. On river trips in the canyon, the gravel bars would become one big cathole if the boaters weren't required to pack it all out. Backpackers are asked to deficate away from campsites, streams, etc. and to carry out the TP (but not the poo).

BTW, one of the reasons for the really nice outhouses on the Alpine Loop 4WD trails in CO is that human excrement and TP were seriously maring the area, and threatening the ecosystem and health of humans downstream. When I was there we camped along one of the mt. streams and used water out of it (purified). No offense, but I don't want somebody's fecal coliform in my water!

BTW, one case where poo in the forest is an issue is a case like Woodstock OR the private horse camping area along the Jacks Fork River near Emminence. In the latter case thousands of horse trail riders will congregate at one time for a long weekend. The amount of human waste and animal waste that is created is enormous, and well more than the environment can handle. Don't take this as antihorse ... but similar to the concern the USFS shows for large groups using a small part of the USFS (Fall Color Tour for example).

As to the teacher voice ... I will do my best to leave work at work, and bring only my fun loving voice to Arkansas!

The federal government's 2009 FS budget is not good for trail maintenance:
http://www.arra-access.com/arra/washing ... b2008.html